ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

8 Replies

ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Daria Knupp on Jan 29, 2019 3:52 pm

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The FAA has mandated Automatic Dependent Surveillance-Broadcast (ADS-B) Out capability for flights after January 1, 2020, in airspace where a transponder is required today. And although the ADS-B final rule was published in May 2010—and right now, let’s call it 12 months to go before January 2—aircraft owners still have a lot of questions. Learn more here.
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Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Ronald Levy on Jan 30, 2019 6:15 pm

...and don't wait.  Too many people have been procrastinating, and are now suddenly leaping to get their ADS-B-out installation.  As a result, avionics shops are already booking out through the spring, and the best one around here has its next open date in JULY!  Wait much longer, and you'll be grounded on 1/1/20 waiting on a shop date.

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Philip Rutherford on Feb 3, 2019 9:53 am

Many aircraft are going to be equipped with required ADS-B equipment by the 2020 deadline. However,  many will not, especially those residing on the many For Sale lists of various publications and websites. After the 2020 deadline, if you purchase one of these listed planes that is not equipped,  what will the FAA require the purchaser to do prior to moving the aircraft if it is either purchased within the Mode C veil or being moved to a field that is within the veil. 

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Ronald Levy on Feb 3, 2019 6:19 pm

Philip Rutherford:
Many aircraft are going to be equipped with required ADS-B equipment by the 2020 deadline. However,  many will not, especially those residing on the many For Sale lists of various publications and websites. After the 2020 deadline, if you purchase one of these listed planes that is not equipped,  what will the FAA require the purchaser to do prior to moving the aircraft if it is either purchased within the Mode C veil or being moved to a field that is within the veil. 

For aircraft without an ADS-B-out, the FAA will required the purchaser to comply with 14 CFR 91.225(g)(2):
 

(g) Requests for ATC authorized deviations from the requirements of this section must be made to the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the concerned airspace within the time periods specified as follows:
...

(2) For operation of an aircraft that is not equipped with ADS-B Out, the request must be made at least 1 hour before the proposed operation.

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Richard Mutzman on Feb 4, 2019 2:21 pm

.... and make sure you budget or offer based upon the cost to install the ADS-B Out. Depending on the transponder that is currently installed, that could be upwards of a $3000+ bill. 

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Max Reason on Apr 8, 2019 1:33 am

I have a question about how ADS-B out and ADS-B in work.

Pilot A has ADS-B out and ADS-B in... and is flying down Valley A between mountains.

Pilot B has ADS-B out and ADS-B in... and is flying down Valley B between mountains.

Just ahead for both pilots, Valley A and Valley B meet/merge and become Valley C.

Because they are in valleys between rural mountains, no line-of-sight communications towers of any kind exist on the mountains surrounding Valley A or Valley B.

My two questions are:

#1:  Will Pilot A and Pilot B be aware of each other before they are line-of-sight to each other?

#2:  Will Pilot A and Pilot B be aware of each other after they become line-of-sight to each other?

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DISCUSSION

If ADS-B signals are sent-to and received-from Iridium or some other satellite network, then Pilot A and Pilot B would always be aware of each other no matter the nature of the topography.

If ADS-B signals are not sent-to and received-from Iridium or some other satellite network, but ADS-B equipment can receive and decode ADS-B signals from other aircraft via direct line-of-sight signals, then the moment Pilot A and Pilot B were line-of-sight to each other, they would be notified of each other.

If ADS-B signals are ONLY relayed by towers but cannot function based upon direct line-of-sight signals from other ADS-B out equipped airplanes, then Pilot A and Pilot B will NEVER be made aware of each other by the ADS-B system.

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It seems obvious to me that ADS-B should function via communication with a satellite network.

But if ADS-B does not work that way, but instead communicates via ground towers, then ADS-B should AT LEAST be capable of direct line-of-sight communication with other nearby aircraft.  After all, those are the aircraft a pilot might soon run into!

So... HOW DOES ADS-B WORK ?????

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Christopher Gordon on Apr 15, 2019 9:48 am

Max Reason:

So... HOW DOES ADS-B WORK ?????

Max, suggest you type "How does ADS-B work" in your favorite search engine for a start.  Google returned 8 sites and 3 videos from credible sources on the first page that illustrate how ADS-B traffic in particular works.  

Short and oversimplified answer is that ADS-B equipped aircraft do communicate directly with each other in addition to ATC and ADS-B ground stations, so your valley flyers should be made aware of each other by the ADS-B system.  

I read recently that Canada is proposing a satellite based ADS-B standard, which would require antenna diversity (antennas on the top and bottom of the aircraft) and compatible ADS-B equipment, which is a significant burden for aircraft that comply with the current ADS-B standard in the United States.

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Barry Fell on Apr 15, 2019 2:01 pm

Anyone know about how many $500. rebates are left?????

Re: ADS-B: ANSWERING YOUR ADS-B QUESTIONS

Posted by Mark Honeycutt on Apr 22, 2019 9:59 am

I believe what's confusing so many is the often quoted phrase, "where a transponder is required today"; because most aircraft currently equipped with a transponder, are not required to have it.  Therefore many assume that since the aircraft is equipped with a transponder, that it's required.  This is simply not true.  The truth is the vast majority of aircraft do not fly into, under or over B & C space, therefore no transponder is required now, nor is ADS-B (out) going to be required come 2020 for most aircraft.  A glance at any chart shows that most airspace is E & G, and most GA aircraft do not fly above 10,000'.   Since so many owners pinch on not buying tubes when they replace their tires, or not replacing vacuum pumps and magnetos after reach many hundreds of hours in operation, or not realizing their alternators are a few decades old, windows damaged by sloppy cleaning, propellors that have not seen a prop shop since installed decades ago, cowl fasteners that should have been replaced a very very long time ago, etc....   Don't get sucked into the gee-wiz factor of pretty color electronic displays when even after the so-called mandate, thousands of aircraft will not have ADS-B (out) because they don't need it, and therefore will not be displayed on the traffic display.  What's compounding the problem, is many aircraft that do have transponders now, won't after 2020 because the transponder will no longer serve a purpose because of the need for ADS-B (out) to get into B and C space.   Please keep looking outside for the traffic, and replace some of that worn out equipment on your airplane instead.